FinWise Bancorp - Earnings Call - Q3 2025

Executive Summary

• EPS of $0.34 beat Wall Street consensus of $0.297, driven by strong loan originations ($1.79B), higher net interest income, and disciplined OpEx; adjusted operating revenue rose to $36.7M, and efficiency ratio improved to 47.6%.
• SPGI “Revenue” missed consensus ($23.86M* vs $28.20M*), partly reflecting definitional differences for banks; net interest margin expanded to 9.01% q/q, though management guided possible Q4 margin compression as revenue from Tally is bifurcated between NII and interchange fees.
• Credit‑enhanced balances grew to ~$41M in Q3 and are projected to reach ~$115M by Q4 (above prior $50–$100M target), a key catalyst for spread/fee growth with low credit risk due to guarantees and reserve accounts.
• Strategic partnership pipeline advanced with DreamFi (financial inclusion products) and Tallied (two Mastercard co‑branded credit card programs launching in Nov. 2025), supporting Payments/MoneyRails and BIN sponsorship initiatives.
• Watchlist NPL migration moderated in Q3 (only ~$3M vs ~up to $12M guided previously), but management expects ~$10–$12M to migrate in Q4; SBA program sales may be impacted by the government shutdown, a near‑term headwind.

What Went Well and What Went Wrong

What Went Well

• Loan originations increased to $1.79B (vs. $1.48B in Q2 and $1.45B YoY), supporting fee and spread income growth as new programs ramp and student lending seasonality provided a tailwind.
• Net interest income rose to $18.6M (from $14.7M), and net interest margin expanded to 9.01% q/q, while adjusted operating revenue reached $36.7M; efficiency ratio improved to 47.6% (59.7% adjusted), evidencing operating leverage.
• Management confidence and pipeline: “Our strong third quarter results reflect the positive impact of the strategic investments we made over the past two years… we remain confident that our focus on disciplined growth and operational excellence will continue to drive long‑term progress” — Kent Landvatter, CEO.
• Low‑risk credit‑enhanced balances grew to $41.4M and are expected to reach ~$115M by year‑end; Tallied’s portfolio adds scale with guarantees and cash reserve protections.

What Went Wrong

• Provision for credit losses rose sharply to $12.8M (vs. $4.7M in Q2; $2.2M YoY), primarily tied to growth in credit‑enhanced balances and higher net charge‑offs; NPLs increased to $42.8M (7.5% of HFI).
• Deposit mix skewed further to time CDs (62.7%), keeping cost of interest‑bearing deposits elevated at 4.06%, limiting funding cost relief; management noted potential NIM compression in Q4 due to Tally revenue mix.
• SBA program exposure to shutdown: approvals and secondary market sales are suspended during the closure, potentially reducing Q4 SBA gain‑on‑sale and hampering throughput, despite limited servicing impact.

Transcript

Operator (participant)

Greetings, and welcome to the FinWise Bancorp Third Quarter 2025 earnings conference call. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. A question and answer session will follow the formal presentation. If anyone should require operator assistance during the conference, please press star zero on your telephone keypad. Please note this conference is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to your host, Juan Arias. Please go ahead.

Juan Arias (Head of Corporate Development and Investor Relations)

Good afternoon, and thank you for joining us today for FinWise Bancorp's third quarter 2025 earnings conference call. Earlier today, we filed our earnings release and investor deck and posted them to our investor website at investors.finwisebancorp.com. Today's conference call is being recorded and webcast on the company's investor website, as previously mentioned. On today's call, management's prepared remarks and answers to your questions may contain forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ from those discussed today. Forward-looking statements represent management's current estimates, expectations, and beliefs, and FinWise Bancorp assumes no obligation to update any forward-looking statements in the future. We encourage listeners to review the more detailed discussions related to these forward-looking statements, including factors that may negatively impact them, contained in the company's earnings press release and filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

Hosting the call today are Kent Landvatter, Chairman and CEO, Jim Noone, Bank CEO, and Bob Wahlman, CFO. Kent, please go ahead.

Kent Landvatter (Chairman and CEO)

Good afternoon, everyone. Our strong third-quarter results demonstrate that the strategic investments we have made over the past two years are starting to deliver meaningful results. During the quarter, we posted robust loan originations of $1.8 billion, and credit-enhanced balances reached $41 million. Revenue growth was solid, driven by both fee and spread income growth, and disciplined expense management further supported profitability. Tangible book value per share continued to increase to $13.84 compared with $13.51 in the prior quarter, reflecting ongoing value creation for our shareholders. Following the close of the third quarter, we announced two additional strategic program agreements that we are very excited about. The first is with DreamFi, a startup financial technology company that will provide financial products and services to underbanked communities.

The second is with Tally Technologies, a program manager and network issuer processor, which will bring FinWise a substantial credit-enhanced portfolio balance in Q4 2025 to support both business and consumer credit card programs. As a reminder, while the credit-enhanced loans acquired in the Tally transactions will increase our balance sheet, the credit risk is low because of the guaranteed provisions of the agreement supported by the cash loss reserve deposit account that Tally must maintain at FinWise to absorb credit loss, as well as the cash flows generated by the assets. We remain actively engaged in discussions with several other potential strategic partners to further expand our strategic initiatives, and our pipeline continues to be strong. Importantly, this partnership with Tally underscores the uniqueness of our one-to-many business model, which we've outlined previously.

While our model can appear lumpy, as securing strategic agreements may sometimes take longer than anticipated, each completed agreement has the potential to unlock substantial value for us. These agreements can drive meaningful increases in portfolio balances and accelerate revenue growth, reinforcing the scalability and strength of our approach. As we discussed last quarter, we are carefully evaluating a measured increase in dollar balances of higher-yielding loans, particularly as our loan portfolio continues to grow. However, we will remain within the internal limits established in 2018 as our policy restricts these loans to less than 10% of the total portfolio. Overall, we are very pleased with our performance this quarter and the solid momentum we're seeing across the business. These results underscore the strength of our strategic execution and our unwavering commitment to long-term value creation rather than prioritizing short-term gains.

As we move forward, we will continue to focus on disciplined growth and operational excellence, key drivers of sustained progress and meaningful returns for our shareholders. With that, let me turn the call over to Jim Noone, our Bank CEO.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Thank you, Kent. The strong momentum from recent quarters continued into Q3, as evidenced by loan origination volume totaling $1.8 billion, a 21% increase quarter over quarter, and a 24% increase year over year. Key drivers included a seasonal uptick from our largest student lending partner in line with the academic calendar and continued ramp in maturation from new programs we have launched over the past several years. While macroeconomic conditions and demand trends may shift interquarter, originations through the first four weeks of October 2025 are tracking at a quarterly rate of approximately $1.4 billion. This reflects the expected seasonal deceleration from our largest student lending partner and fewer business days in the quarter due to multiple holidays. We expect a 5% annualized rate of growth in originations from this $1.4 billion quarterly level during 2026 is appropriate, based on organic growth right now.

We are also pleased that credit-enhanced balances reached $41 million at the end of the third quarter. To support your modeling efforts of these assets, let me provide an outlook for the remainder of 2025 and into 2026. Incremental organic growth in credit-enhanced balances is running at approximately $8 million in October, and we are currently comfortable projecting $8 million per month in incremental organic balances for each November and December of 2025. Additionally, as previously mentioned, our recently announced agreement with program manager Tally Technologies is scheduled to close on December 1st. We anticipate this transaction to contribute approximately $50 million in credit-enhanced balances late in the quarter, for a projected total of approximately $115 million in credit-enhanced balances by the end of the fourth quarter. This compares to our prior expectations for $50 million-$100 million by the end of the fourth quarter of this year.

Looking ahead to 2026, we are currently comfortable with organic growth in credit-enhanced balances of $8 million-$10 million per month right now. Quarterly SBA 7(a) loan originations declined 7.8% quarter over quarter and are up 68% year-over-year. The quarter over quarter decrease primarily reflects typical third-quarter seasonality. Importantly, the recent federal government shutdown may impact FinWise's SBA lending operations in the following ways: First, loan approvals. While FinWise can work with applicants to prepare documentation and complete bank underwriting, all new loan approvals for the SBA 7(a) and 504 loan programs are currently suspended. Second, loan closings. FinWise can close previously approved loans if there are no change actions requiring SBA approval, but some loan closings will be impacted until the government reopens. Third, secondary market sales. Loan sales require approval by the fiscal transfer agent, and this is currently suspended during the government shutdown.

Loan servicing is not materially impacted by the shutdown, and we also do not anticipate the government closure will be detrimental to credit quality, as FinWise does not need SBA approval for most of the actions we take in servicing and liquidation. While our SBA lending is impacted by the current government shutdown, this has happened in the past when Congress was unable to agree on budgetary matters, and FinWise was successful in managing its pipeline of loan applicants, loan closings, and loan sales through similar periods. We continue to monitor the situation closely and remain focused on maintaining strong pipeline activity heading into Q4. During the past quarter, we continued to sell guaranteed portions of our SBA loans as market premiums remained favorable. We will continue to follow this strategy as long as market conditions remain favorable.

That said, the current government shutdown may impact the amount of loans that we can sell in the fourth quarter. Importantly, our SBA guaranteed balances and strategic program loans held for sale, both characterized by lower credit risk, collectively represent 40% of our total portfolio at the end of Q3, underscoring the lower risk composition of our loan portfolio. Turning to credit quality, the total provision for credit losses was $12.8 million in the third quarter, of which $8.8 million is attributable to growth of credit-enhanced balances in the quarter. This compares to a total provision of $4.7 million in the prior quarter, of which $2.3 million was attributable to growth of credit-enhanced balances.

As a reminder, the provision for credit losses associated with the credit-enhanced loan portfolio is different from core portfolio provisions because it's fully offset by the recognition of future recoveries pursuant to the partner guarantee of an exact amount described as credit enhancement income in our non-interest income. Quarterly net charge-offs were $3.1 million in the third quarter versus $2.8 million in the prior quarter. For modeling purposes, we continue to believe that approximately $3.3 million is a good quarterly number to use. This level has remained consistent on a quarterly basis over the last two years, and it's in line with our expectations following the portfolio de-risking initiative we implemented a little over two years ago. During Q3, only $3 million in loans migrated to NPL, bringing our total NPL balance to $42.8 million at the end of the quarter.

This modest increase was mostly due to SBA 7(a) loans classified as NPL and compares to guidance on our prior call that up to $12 million in balances could migrate during the third quarter. The lower-than-expected migration reflects the team's proactive efforts in selling collateral, securing paydowns, and receiving reimbursements on the guaranteed portions of SBA loans that have become classified. Of the $42.8 million in total NPL balances, $23.3 million, or 54%, is guaranteed by the federal government, and $19.4 million is unguaranteed. Looking ahead, while we expect a gradual moderation in NPL migration, as loans underwritten in lower interest rate environments continue to season, migration may remain lumpy. For the fourth quarter, we anticipate that approximately $10 million-$12 million in watchlist loans could migrate to NPL. I will now turn the call over to our CFO, Bob Wahlman, to provide more detail on our financial results.

Bob Wahlman (CFO)

Thanks, Jim, and good afternoon, everyone. We reported net income of $4.9 million for the third quarter, representing a 19% increase from the $4.1 million reported in the prior quarter and a 42% increase year-over-year. Diluted earnings per share rose to $0.34, up from $0.29 in the previous quarter and $0.25 in the same quarter last year. These results reflect strong operational execution and sustained business momentum across our core segments. Our strong performance was driven by several factors, including a notable increase in loan originations and a significant rise in credit-enhanced balances. These trends contributed to higher net interest income, reflecting increased average loan balances across both our held-for-investment and our held-for-sale portfolios. This was partially offset by the reversal of interest income on newly classified non-accrual loans.

We also posted solid non-interest income, largely driven by a substantial increase in strategic program fees and higher gain on sale of loans. As a reminder, for accounting purposes, credit-enhanced income is an offset to the provision for credit losses on the credit-enhanced loan balances, and net does not have an effect on net income. On the expense side, the increase in credit-enhanced expenses is for the servicing and the guarantee on the credit-enhanced loans, so it reflects the growth in the credit-enhanced loan portfolio. Excluding the credit-enhanced expenses, we remain disciplined with our compensation and other operating expenses. Total end-of-period assets reached nearly $900 million for the first time in the company's history. This achievement reflects robust balance sheet expansion fueled by sustained loan growth and our disciplined approach to capital deployment.

Average loan balances, including held-for-sale and held-for-investment loans, totaled $683 million for the quarter, compared to $634 million in the prior quarter. This increase included notable growth in strategic program loans with credit enhancement, commercial leases, residential real estate, and owner-occupied commercial real estate. Average interest-bearing deposits were $524 million, compared to $494 million in the prior quarter. The sequential quarter increase was driven mainly by an increase in wholesale time certificates of deposits, but we also had a modest pickup in other deposit categories, including demand, savings, and money market deposits. Net interest income increased to $18.6 million from the prior quarter's $14.7 million, primarily due to an increase in credit-enhanced balances and rates in the held-for-investment portfolio and the higher average balances in the strategic program loans in the held-for-sale portfolio, partially offset by higher average balances of brokered CD accounts.

Net interest margin increased to 9.01% compared to 7.81% in the prior quarter, driven mainly by growth in the credit-enhanced portfolio, offset in part by accrued interest reversals on loan migrations to non-accrual during the prior quarter. As a reminder, the net interest margin can be affected by specific terms of each new credit-enhanced loan program or by the mix of loan growth of existing credit-enhanced portfolios. While generally, new credit-enhanced agreements will expand the NIM from the current levels, some agreements could cause NIM to compress. In terms of a net interest margin outlook for the fourth quarter, we could see some compression in the margin relative to Q3. This is primarily driven by the onboarding of a substantial volume of average balances through our new strategic partnership with Tally Technologies.

While this initiative supports overall revenue growth, the revenue contribution from these balances is bifurcated between net interest income and interchange fees. As a result, a portion of the revenue generated by this agreement will be captured in net interest income, and a portion will be captured in non-interest income. As a portion of the economic benefit to FinWise Bancorp will be captured in non-interest income, the resulting net interest margin from adding this program may be lower than expected. Looking beyond the fourth quarter, we suggest thinking about our net interest margin in two distinct ways, including and excluding credit-enhanced balances. When including credit-enhanced balances, the margin is projected to increase, supported by the continued expansion of our credit-enhanced loan portfolio and strategic efforts to lower our cost of funding. This upward trend is expected to persist until growth in these balances begins to moderate.

Conversely, excluding credit-enhanced balances, we anticipate a gradual decline in margin, consistent with our ongoing risk reduction strategy. Fee income was $18.1 million in the quarter, compared to $10.3 million in the prior quarter. The sequential quarter increase was primarily driven by the substantial increase in credit enhancement income, continued growth in strategic program fees due to stronger originations and gains on sale of loans. As noted earlier, credit enhancement income is fully offset by the provision for loan losses related to credit-enhanced loans and increases as we grow our credit-enhanced loan balances outstanding each quarter. Non-interest expense for the quarter totaled $17.4 million, an increase from $14.9 million in the prior quarter. The pickup was primarily driven by higher credit enhancement expenses, including the servicing and cost of the guarantees on the credit-enhanced loans, reflecting the continued growth in the credit-enhanced loan portfolios.

Importantly, when excluding credit enhancement costs, operating expenses increased only modestly, with the uptick largely concentrated in other operating expenses. This was mainly due to servicing expenses associated with the balance sheet programs of our strategic programs. The reported efficiency ratio is 47.6% versus 59.5% in the prior quarter. The decline was due mainly to the increase in credit-enhanced fee income and gain on SBA loan sales previously discussed. Removing the income statement effects of the credit-enhanced loans, a non-GAAP measure, the efficiency ratio was 59.7% versus 65.3% in the prior quarter, implying solid operating leverage in the quarter due to strong revenue growth and disciplined expense management. Although further improvement in the efficiency ratio may be less pronounced in future periods, we remain focused on driving sustainable, positive operating leverage with a long-term goal of steadily lowering our core efficiency ratio.

That said, there may be periods in which the efficiency ratio may increase. Our effective tax rate was 23.7% for the quarter, compared to 24.5% in the prior quarter. The decrease in the prior quarter was due primarily to the increase in deferred tax assets related to restricted stock, increased allowances for loan losses, and accrued bonuses. While multiple factors may influence the actual tax rate, we currently expect the fourth quarter of 2025's tax rate to be approximately 26%. With that, we would like to open up the call for questions and answers. Operator?

Operator (participant)

Thank you. We will now be conducting a question and answer session. If you would like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. A confirmation tone will indicate your line is in the question queue. You may press star two if you would like to remove your question from the queue. For participants using speaker equipment, it may be necessary to pick up your handset before pressing the star keys. That is star one to ask a question. Our first question will come from Joe Yanchunis with Raymond James.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Good afternoon.

Kent Landvatter (Chairman and CEO)

Hi, Joe.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Hey, Joe. Good afternoon.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Hey, as you outlined in your prepared remarks, credit-enhanced loan balances are going to exceed your year-end target, largely due to receiving the Tally loans. Given your outlook for credit-enhanced loans, can you discuss what level of concentration you're comfortable with for these in your loan portfolio?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Some of the concentration policies, Joe, really are limited by percentage of the portfolio by program, and I would tell you that they top out at about 15% per program.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Okay, that's per program, not per loan type.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

That's correct. Yes, it is.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Okay. Can you talk a little more about the net reductions in FTEs and compliance and risk functions? I understand the percentage of employees in these oversight roles remained unchanged, but is there any new systems that you put in place to automate certain functions to allow fewer employees to oversee more volume?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

The employee right now, the number has dropped a little bit. It's not due to any AI or what have you in the system. It's just us being very disciplined about what we're doing here. However, we are analyzing, as many other banks, our potential efficiency impacts from AI.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Okay, I appreciate it. Just a couple kind of clarification questions for me. Forgive me if this has already been covered, but what is the difference between credit enhancement program expenses and credit enhancement guaranteed expenses?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

We're just being more specific. What was in previous periods referenced as credit enhancement expenses is referring to the actual amount that we're paying for guarantees on those credit enhancement programs. The other component piece that's included in the expense section, but is not specified, was not being included in what was previously described as credit enhanced expenses, is a servicing cost related to those credit enhancement loans. That's rather insignificant relative to the guarantee amounts that are being paid.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

Okay, perfect. Just kind of last clarification question for me. You talked about some accrued interest reversals in the quarter. Can you quantify that impact?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Could you repeat the question, please?

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

The accrued interest reversals in the quarter that boosted loan yields in the NIM.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Oh, yeah, that was the accrued interest reversal during the period, it was about $175,000. That is when a loan goes non-performing and we have to reverse the interest that had previously been accrued on a loan when it reaches 90 days past due. That was $175,000 in this quarter compared to $514,000 last quarter.

Joe Yanchunis (Senior Equity Research Associate)

All right. I appreciate that. Thanks for taking my questions.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Thanks, Joe.

Operator (participant)

Our next question comes from Andrew Terrell with Stephens Inc.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Hey, good afternoon.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Hey, Andrew.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

I'm just thinking about kind of net growth of the balance sheet into the coming year. Jim, I appreciate the guidance you gave around the credit enhanced. That's really helpful. Should we expect the entirety of your loan growth going forward to come from that credit enhanced product or products? Should we expect growth in any areas outside of that?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

I think you'll see growth across the board, Andrew. I think that would be the primary driver, though. That's where you'll see the biggest pickup. If you look at our SBA portfolio, we've been selling about as much production as we're putting on the guaranteed portions, at least in the last quarter or two. In the equipment leasing, you see upticks each quarter. Yes, generally, the credit-enhanced portfolio is where the meaningful growth on the portfolio side will come from.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Okay, got it. You're going to outperform this $50 million-$100 million guide, it sounds like, by the time we end this year. If we kind of extrapolate the baseline, you're talking of monthly growth for 2026. It implies just a little more than $100 million of credit-enhanced growth in 2026. I'm just curious, what could cause you to deviate either positively or even negatively versus this established baseline we're thinking about for 2026?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Yeah. We're looking at about $115 million by the end of the year, and that's above previous guidance of the $50 million-$100 million. We're happy about that. You know, like you mentioned, we're currently comfortable with organic growth there. Call it starting January 1 of about $8 million-$10 million, based on what we're currently seeing in trends. What would cause us to outperform that? It would be an acceleration. There are four live programs today, Andrew. There's the fifth program coming online in December with Tally. Of the four live programs, two have kind of good established trends month over month. I would say two are still kind of lagging as far as just growth. If you have those two programs start to hit more of their stride, you could have upside.

On the downside, I would say really, if you have some material weakness in performance, when we underwrite these, we stress them pretty highly, both with a 50% and 100% stress on charge-off rates, and then we look at high watermarks. If we have meaningful deterioration in performance there, and we have to stop originations for one of those programs, that's where you would see underperformance versus the kind of trend that we're talking about, at $115 million to start the year and then $8 million-$10 million of organic growth monthly throughout the year.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Got it. Okay. If I could clarify one on the expenses, I'm looking at the credit enhancement guarantee expense of $1.720 million in the quarter compared to, you know, in the adjustment section, you're breaking out the total credit enhancement program expense of $1.968 million. Is the delta of that what you're referring to as the, you know, kind of service, the incremental servicing costs that I'm assuming would be kind of variable as this loan portfolio grows?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Yes, it is. That would be the difference.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Okay. It is variable, so increases going forward?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

The servicing cost is typically stated as a percentage of the assets, and that will vary as the program matures and grows.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Okay. If I look at that, that was in kind of the other expense line in the third quarter that stepped up. It essentially implies the other expense stepped up $400,000 or so in the quarter. I'm just curious, any other specific drivers to the step up in the other expense? I'm just trying to get kind of a clean run rate.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

The largest one that you noted there was the servicing expenses on these credit-enhanced portfolios. The other changes that are included in there are deposits are higher, so we have a little bit higher FDIC deposit insurance assessment. Just generally, data services and software costs are included in there that also increase.

Andrew Terrell (Managing Director and Research Analyst)

Yep. Okay. Perfect. Thank you for taking the questions.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

No problem. Thanks, Andrew.

Operator (participant)

As a reminder, if you'd like to ask a question, please press *1 on your telephone keypad. We'll go next to Brett Rabatin with Hovde Group.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Hey, guys. Good afternoon.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Good afternoon. Brett?

Morning.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Wanted to ask a question on the credit enhancement. Some of the loans that you're adding through these programs are credit-enhanced and some are not guaranteed. Can you maybe break apart the decision on what you're doing with the two pieces there and why there's two buckets?

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Yeah. I think you're probably looking at the table on page five of the earnings release, Brett. Is that right?

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Yep.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Yeah. Okay. So you've got two kind of subline items there under strategic program loans, one with credit enhancement. That's the credit enhancement program that we've been talking about, and it's been a meaningful, starting to become a meaningful growth driver of assets in the portfolio. The without credit enhancement, those are, you can call them like full risk retention programs that we have. We have three, there's four active programs there. Most of them were retention programs that we've been active with really over the last four or five years. Those balances have been pretty stable. We talked in the last quarter or two about the fact that they may start ticking up here. You see them, they were pretty flat in the June quarter versus the same period last year. You did see them pick up a little bit, $3 million or so in this quarter.

We had talked about that. In that program, you're getting full yield, but you're taking full NCO exposure as well. With a few of our partners, we've got anywhere from 2%-5% retention rates. Every loan that comes through that we originate at the bank, we will hold 2%-5% of the receivable, and then we sell 98%-95% of the receivable to an SPV or back to the partner. That loan balance will stay on our balance sheet through payoff or charge-off. We're capturing all of the yield. We're capturing all of the credit risk. That's been a fairly stable number. It's starting to tick up a little bit. I think Kent, in some of his remarks over the last quarter or two, has mentioned that we're looking at potentially growing that a little bit here. Does that help?

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Okay. Yeah, that's helpful. I just, for some reason, was thinking that you guys were going to transfer those programs into the strategic with credit enhancement, and so those balances were going to go down instead of up, but that makes sense.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Yeah, different set of programs.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Right, right. Wanted to ask, you mentioned the margin down in the fourth quarter with continued de-risking. Can you maybe talk about how much you're expecting? When I look at the CDs that cost $422 in the third quarter, with rate cuts, I'm wondering if the CD book might be an opportunity on the margin.

Kent Landvatter (Chairman and CEO)

Sure. Let me tackle that one. What I was referring to in my comments was that we have Tally Technologies coming on during the fourth quarter, late in the fourth quarter. Tally Technologies is a little bit of a different structure of transaction where the revenue is in part related to interest income, which is low, which is going to be only part of the revenue we collect from it. We're also going to collect from that portfolio the additional fees.Interchange fees. Thank you. Depending upon when that program comes on and how quickly these other programs continue to wrap up, that could result in a little bit of a toss-up in regards to whether we end up with margin increase or margin decrease during the fourth quarter.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Okay, that's helpful. On MoneyRails and payments, do we have to wait for January for maybe some thoughts on potential revenue in 2026? If we do, okay, but was hoping for maybe any early color you could give. Particularly MoneyRails and payments, maybe any pipeline on potential partners from here.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

Sure. As far as card scope first, we just announced DreamFi and Tally Technologies. We actually expect DreamFi will generate some deposits for us in the latter half of 2026, especially. We also have the standard banking behind that, so we would be moving money back and forth on money rails with them. We also have additional partners that we expect to generate not only deposits, but money rails, fee income, as well as some BIN Sponsorship opportunities as well in the pipeline right now. Does that answer your question?

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Yeah, that's helpful. I don't know if you want to give any kind of early thoughts around potential revenue magnitude, but that would be helpful if you think about the coming year.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

I don't think we're ready at this time, but what we said before is it will become more meaningful in the latter half of 2026. We think you'll get more of a steady state in 2027 that's more predictable. As we get more information here, you know, we'll share that with you.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Okay. Last one for me, just around expenses. You mentioned earlier that, you know, AI was not a driver for 3Q, but I know 36% of your FTE count is in compliance, IT, etc. Is that an opportunity, you guys think, over the next year? You know.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

That's a great question. The way we kind of think of it is we build a platform to continue to launch partners. We really don't look at it as in the terms of headcount reduction. What we do look at it as is the ability to moderate headcount, especially production-related headcount, as we grow. That's really where we see the lift there because we do have a lot of requirements and oversight and so forth. We think we're right-sized there, but future growth is where we see the opportunity.

Brett Rabatin (Director of Research)

Okay. Fair enough. Thanks for all the color, guys.

Jim Noone (President and CEO)

No problem.

Operator (participant)

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your participation. This does conclude today's teleconference. You may disconnect your lines and have a wonderful day.