Synaptics - Q4 2024

Transcript

Operator (participant)

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Synaptics, Inc. Fourth Quarter Fiscal Year 2024 Financial Results Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in listen-only mode. After the speaker's presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. To ask a question during the session, you will need to press star one one on your telephone. You will then hear an automated message advising your hand is raised. To withdraw your question, please press star one one again. Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your first speaker today, Munjal Shah, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

Munjal Shah (Head of Investor Relations)

Thank you. Good afternoon, and thank you for joining us today on Synaptics' fourth quarter fiscal 2024 conference call. My name is Munjal Shah, and I'm the Head of Investor Relations. With me on today's call are Michael Hurlston, our President and CEO, Ken Rizvi, our CFO, and Matt Padfield, our Vice President of Finance. This call is also being broadcast live over the web and can be accessed from the investor relations section of the company's website at synaptics.com. In addition to a supplemental slide presentation, we have also posted a copy of these prepared remarks on our investor relations website. In addition to the company's GAAP results, management will also provide supplementary results on a non-GAAP basis, which excludes share-based compensation, acquisition-related costs, and certain other non-cash or recurring or non-recurring items.

Please refer to the press release issued after the market closed today for a detailed reconciliation of GAAP and Non-GAAP results, which can be accessed from the investor relations section of the company's website at Synaptics.com. Additionally, we would like to remind you that during the course of this conference call, Synaptics will make forward-looking statements. Forward-looking statements give our current expectations and projections relating to our financial condition, results of operation, plans, objectives, future performance, and business. Although Synaptics believes our estimates and assumptions to be reasonable, they are subject to a number of risks and uncertainties beyond our control and may prove to be inaccurate. Synaptics cautions that actual results may differ materially from any future performance suggested in the company's forward-looking statements.

We refer you to the company's current and periodic reports filed with the SEC, including our most recent annual report on Form 10-K and quarterly report on Form 10-Q, for important risk factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those contained in any forward-looking statement. Synaptics expressly disclaims any obligation to update this forward-looking information. I will now turn the call over to Michael.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Thanks, Munjal. I'd like to welcome everybody to today's call. We just closed our 2024 fiscal year, and while for the most part, it didn't play out as we planned, we were able to accomplish some of our most important goals. During the year, we stabilized revenue and began to show incremental growth, though at a slower rate versus our prior expectations, due to muted end demand recovery. In addition, we were able to get largely clear of the inventory issues that plagued us for the last six quarters or so. Finally, Core IoT is on the right track, showing significant, albeit somewhat inconsistent, growth after bottoming in the fourth quarter of last year. As we enter fiscal 2025, we are in a better place overall to drive revenue and earnings growth.

Moving to the June quarter, revenue was slightly above the midpoint of our guidance range, with enterprise products incrementally above forecast. Non-GAAP gross margin came in at roughly the midpoint of our guidance, while non-GAAP OpEx was below target, resulting in non-GAAP EPS above the forecast provided in May. This quarter marked more success in our Core IoT products, which grew 63% year-over-year, primarily driven by wireless. We taped out our first broad market device that features a more than 50% power reduction and a 40% decrease in die size as compared to a similar high-performance device. Even with these advances, we maintain our overall throughput and interoperability advantages, thereby delivering the best overall solution in this product category.

The chip is on track to sample to customers toward the end of the calendar year, with revenue contribution expected to start in the middle of calendar 2025. Our first Wi-Fi 7 device is slightly ahead of schedule, and we expect to be sampling customers toward the end of this coming quarter. In addition, demand for our shipping Wi-Fi, Bluetooth combos, and GPS products continues to improve. Pre-production has started on several of our key design wins in product categories such as drones, sound systems, wearables, and OTT streamers. We have had success adding new module partners in Japan, Korea, and China, though progress to high volume shipments has been slower than expected. We expect wireless revenue to continue to improve, and while quarter-over-quarter growth rates may vary, we continue to believe that double-digit increases will occur on a year-over-year basis.

We are also making progress with our smart embedded processors. Following a successful launch last quarter, Astra, our embedded AI-enabled line of MPUs and MCUs, has generated interest from a broad set of customers in product categories such as navigation devices, appliances, and security systems. Initial demand for our Machina RDKs exceeded expectations, and we are ramping production for commercial availability. We made our software generally available, making it easier for customers to integrate, lowering barrier to adoption. Finally, we are building relationships with system integrators and system-on-module partners who enable us to scale significantly faster. In the quarter, we started sampling our SR Series of smart MCUs for vision-based use cases. In addition, we are driving synergies in our compute and wireless portfolios and are sampling our first Astra connected processor in a package, combining our Wi-Fi 6/6E device with our quad-core A55 processors.

While Astra's customer traction is ahead of schedule, we haven't changed our outlook, and the products won't contribute materially until the second half of our fiscal 2026. While our smart embedded processors are the future, our operator solutions product family continues to generate revenue today. Our recently announced wins have started to ramp, and over the last quarter, we added new customers in Japan, with production launches expected in calendar 2025. Moving to our Enterprise and Automotive products, revenue improved 7% on quarter, driven by improvement in our video interface and PC products. In PCs, we're gaining market share at multiple OEMs and driving higher content with larger touchpads and haptics technology. We do think the PC TAM continues to grow as adoption of AI PCs and Arm-based platforms drives a refresh cycle.

Our user presence detection solution has been awarded both mid-board and camera module platforms at a major customer, stepping up our share in model year 2025. We are working to sell these AI-based devices to additional customers and expect further adoption, given the system's power savings they can deliver, translating to longer PC battery life. While we were able to grow enterprise product sales sequentially, we continue to be disappointed at the rate of recovery. IT spending on personal hardware remains below, well below historic norms as capital is being allocated toward AI infrastructure. In automotive, the overall market softness is slowing the adoption of new technology. This has been good for us, as our existing TDDI solutions are expected to remain in production longer. However, uptake of our new SmartBridge product is being pushed out, limiting our content gains near term.

In addition, our legacy DDIC devices continue to moderate as production shifts away from older models. In Mobile, our touch controllers are aligned with the high end of the Android market, which is seeing normal seasonal trends. We do see an opportunity for TAM expansion as flexible OLED displays come down in price and capture a higher percentage of the volume at a given OEM. Our technical advantages in extracting signal from a very noisy environment give us more than sufficient differentiation to garner high market share, both in China and Korea. We had multiple ramps and design wins across major Android smartphone OEMs this quarter. We remain confident in our market position, and starting next year, we expect our Mobile products to largely track the high-end Android market. To conclude, we continue to be excited about our Core IoT opportunity, particularly on processors and wireless.

Through new product ramps and customer engagements, we have set ourselves up for a bright future. In addition, we have cleared most of the inventory problems that plagued our enterprise products for the last few quarters and positioned us for a steadier phase of growth. We have set the company up for earnings and cash flow growth in 2025 and beyond. Before I turn the call over to Matt for a review of our fourth quarter financial results and our first quarter outlook, let me take a second to introduce our new CFO, Ken Rizvi. I'm pleased to have Ken join the team, and I'm looking forward to getting his help in driving profitable growth for Synaptics. He's a seasoned finance and semiconductor executive, having previously served as CFO of a public company. Ken, can you make a few comments?

Ken Rizvi (CFO)

Thanks, Michael, and good afternoon to everyone. Several of you know me from my previous roles, and I'm excited to join Synaptics at this stage of the company. Michael and the team have done a phenomenal job transforming the company into a leading IoT player. I'm looking forward to build upon that foundation and help the company drive long-term growth. I look forward to meeting you all in the upcoming weeks and months, and as it's only been a few weeks since I've joined, I'll hand the call over to my colleague, Matt, to review our financials. Matt?

Matt Padfield (VP of Finance)

Thanks, Ken, and good afternoon to everyone. I will focus my remarks primarily on our non-GAAP results, which are reconciled to GAAP in the earnings release table and in our investor materials on our website. Now, let me turn to our financial results for fiscal 2024 and Q4. We completed our fiscal year 2024 with net revenue of $959 million, which was 29% down compared to $1.36 billion in the prior year, largely due to declines in our Core IoT and Enterprise and Automotive products, and partially offset by growth from our Mobile products. While demand in fiscal 2024 was soft across multiple end markets, we were able to grow revenues into the second half of the year, while also reducing channel inventories to near normal levels.

Non-GAAP gross margin for fiscal 2024 came in at 53.0%. Non-GAAP net income for fiscal year 2024 was $89.4 million, or $2.25 per diluted share.

The company continues to be solidly cash flow positive, generating $135.9 million in cash from operations in fiscal year 2024. Now, let me turn to our Q4 results. Revenue for Q4 was $247.4 million, above the midpoint of our guidance, with sequential improvement in our Core IoT and Enterprise and Automotive products. Revenue from Core IoT, Enterprise and Automotive, and Mobile products were 22%, 58%, and 20% respectively. This was largely in line with our previous expectations, with Enterprise and Automotive products above our original forecast. Total Q4 revenues were up 9% on a year-over-year basis, benefiting from reduced inventory digestion, and was up 4% sequentially.

In Q4, Core IoT product revenue was up 63% year-over-year due to reduced inventory digestion, and up 15% sequentially, reflecting a modest recovery in the wireless end market. Enterprise and automotive product revenue was up 2% year-over-year and up 7% sequentially. We saw our PC products improve seasonally on a sequential basis, while we expect the enterprise inventory correction to be largely behind us, and demand for these products continues to be relatively soft. Mobile product revenue was down 6% year-over-year and 11% sequentially. The quarter-over-quarter performance was primarily due to seasonal trends and largely in line with our prior expectations. During the quarter, we had two customers greater than 10% of revenue, each at approximately 12%. Q4 non-GAAP gross margin was 53.4% and in line with the midpoint of our guidance range.

Our fourth quarter Non-GAAP operating expense was $96.5 million and towards the low end of our guidance as we continue to maintain tight expense control. Non-GAAP net income in Q4 was $25.6 million, an increase of 22% from the prior quarter and a 31% increase from the same quarter a year ago. Non-GAAP EPS per diluted share of $0.64 was above the midpoint of our guidance range, helped in part by lower than anticipated operating expenses. Now, turning to the balance sheet. We ended the quarter and fiscal year with $877 million of cash, cash equivalents, and short-term investments on hand, up $49 million from the preceding quarter. Cash flow from operations was $65 million. Capital expenditures were $7.7 million, and depreciation for the quarter was $6.8 million.

Receivables at the end of June were $142 million, and days of sales outstanding were 52 days, down from 55 days last quarter. Our ending inventory balance was $114 million, flat compared to last quarter, as we continue to manage our inventory purchases. The calculated days of inventory on our balance sheet were 88. Our cash balance is at a healthy level, with ample flexibility to navigate our capital deployment needs. We continue to prioritize our capital allocation between M&A, debt management, and share repurchases. Now, let me turn to our first quarter of 2025 guidance. We expect revenues to be approximately $255 million at the midpoint, ±$15 million.

Our guidance for the first quarter reflects an expected revenue mix from Core IoT, Enterprise and Automotive, and Mobile products in the September quarter to be approximately 23%, 58%, and 19%, respectively. We are seeing stabilization and return to normalcy in our business, with order trends and pipelines starting to modestly improve. However, recovery continues to be slow and gradual in almost all of our end markets. We expect non-GAAP gross margin to be 53.5% at the midpoint, ±1%, consistent with the previous quarter. We expect non-GAAP operating expense in the September quarter to be $96 million at the midpoint, ±$2 million. Given the slower pace of recovery and continued macroeconomic uncertainties, we remain focused on managing our overall operating expenses.

We expect non-GAAP net interest and other expense to be approximately $6 million in the September quarter. We recently completed a project that included the domestication of certain foreign subsidiaries and the onshoring of certain intellectual property. This is expected to reduce our non-GAAP tax rate to a range of 13%-15%. Non-GAAP net income per diluted share is anticipated to be $0.75 per share at the midpoint, ±$0.20 on an estimated 40.3 million fully diluted shares. This wraps up our prepared remarks. I'd like to now turn the call over to the operator to start the Q&A session.

Operator (participant)

Thank you. At this time, we will now conduct a question-and-answer session. As a reminder, to ask a question, you'll need to press star one one on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star one one again. Please stand by while we compile our Q&A roster. Our first question comes from the line of Kevin Cassidy with Rosenblatt Securities. The line is yours.

Kevin Cassidy (Managing Director and Senior Research Analyst)

Yeah, thanks for taking my question, and congratulations on the good results. Also, welcome, Ken. Looking forward to working with you again.

Ken Rizvi (CFO)

Yeah, thanks, Kevin.

Kevin Cassidy (Managing Director and Senior Research Analyst)

You know, you mentioned that enterprise spending is down, but the inventory's been cleared out. I'm wondering if you're hearing of any spending coming up, maybe starting a new year, anything that would be related to the video interface revenue? It seems, you know, that was strong growth for a few years, and just like, I think that's it would be positive also, just make sure it would be positive for gross margin also.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, Kevin, first, thanks for the question and good positive comments. You know, we did see the video interface business come up a bit this quarter, which is encouraging. It's been probably six quarters or more of negative, so it was really good to see it come up, although off a much lower base. You know, I think we would start seeing indications of buying patterns as IT budgets get reset in December, probably maybe late November, early December. Those are typically when things get reset, and I think we'd have a much better handle on how our back half looks then. But I think our, you know, to your point, I think our video interface business has probably finally bottomed, and I think we're expecting pretty decent year-over-year growth this year.

Kevin Cassidy (Managing Director and Senior Research Analyst)

Okay, great. Thanks for that answer. And also, you mentioned that AI PC as being a growth driver. And just wondering if you have any more exposure between the Arm-based AI PCs or x86, or are you neutral on that?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Generally neutral. I'd say generally neutral. The one opportunity we're seeing on the Arm-based PCs is to add connectivity content. So generally, we have zero connectivity content on the traditional PCs. We do think we have an opportunity to add connectivity on Arm-based PCs, particularly, you know, non-Qualcomm Arm-based PCs, who will bundle their own Wi-Fi, I would presume. But on the other platforms, we think there's a decent opportunity. But generally speaking, it's flat because our touchpad, fingerprint, the main content is neutral, Kevin, across the various platforms.

Kevin Cassidy (Managing Director and Senior Research Analyst)

Okay, great. I'll get back in the queue. Thanks.

Operator (participant)

Thank you for your question. Our next question comes from the line of Quinn Bolton of Needham. The line is yours. Our next question comes from the line of Quinn Bolton from Needham. The line is yours.

Quinn Bolton (Managing Director and Equity Research Analyst)

Oh, sorry, guys, I was on mute. I was gonna say, I just wanted to echo my congratulations, Michael, and welcome Ken to Synaptics. I guess, you know, you guys have had some momentum on the Core IoT business, mostly driven by wireless. I think in the script, Michael, you said you expected that business to be lumpy, but to still grow double digits as you come into next year. I guess, looking at the ramp off the bottom, you know, double digits could actually, you know, if it's low double digits, might actually, you know, imply some declines on a sequential basis. And so I'm wondering if you might be able to give us, you know, some thoughts on sequential growth rates in that business.

I know you said it's lumpy, but would you expect the trend still to be up generally on a quarter-over-quarter basis?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, yeah, definitely. I'm sorry if we left you with that impression, Quinn, but I would say on a sequential basis, we'd expect strong growth. Obviously, we had a couple of quarters here on a backward-looking basis that were really, really significant. As you correctly point out, it was off a low base. But, you know, as we look forward, we would expect that growth to continue both on an annual and a sequential basis.

Quinn Bolton (Managing Director and Equity Research Analyst)

Got it. Perfect. And then I guess maybe just following up on the last question about the enterprise, the video interface, the PC business. You know, how important or, you know, how significant of a driver do you think an AI PC upgrade cycle would be? Do you think that it would pull through a lot of the video interface? Do you think it would just be primarily on the PC side, the touchpads and fingerprint sensors? Just, you know, can you give us your latest thoughts on, you know, how much you might benefit from an AI PC upgrade cycle? And I'm probably thinking that happens more next year than second half of calendar 2024, but, yeah, would love your latest thoughts.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, I think you sort of got the timing right. And if you remember in our last call, and you and I had this discussion, we have not yet seen ordering patterns that would be consistent with a big refresh cycle, whether that's AI PCs, whether that's Arm PCs, whether that just has to do with sweating these PCs for a lot longer than they typically are. A typical refresh cycle is sort of 3.5-4 years, and we're probably at, you know, 4.5-5 at this point. So we would expect just a natural refresh happening there. But generally speaking, haven't seen it. It's a little bit early from our perspective to call it.

The thing that you did hit on, which I would expect to be true, is that PC buying is gonna pull through a lot of our other products. You typically see, and we saw it certainly during the pandemic, when PCs were going out the door at a relatively high rate, it was pulling through docking stations, it was pulling through headsets, it was pulling through monitors and other things that we have exposure to. So I think if it does happen, it's a nice tailwind for us, but we haven't seen it. We haven't seen the orders come in yet. We're seeing growth, but moderated growth. But, you know, we remain optimistic. We hear everybody else's calls talking about it, and we're certainly hopeful that that helps us in the ensuing quarters.

Quinn Bolton (Managing Director and Equity Research Analyst)

Great. Thank you.

Operator (participant)

Thank you for your question. Our next question comes from the line of Krish Sankar from TD Cowen. The line is yours.

Speaker 9

Hey, guys. This is Eddie for Krish. Michael, you shared your expectation of Wi-Fi growing double digit. You also talked about sampling Wi-Fi 7, ahead of schedule, and some of the design wins there. So it feels like there are some good tailwinds, but I wonder if you guys have a growth range that you can share in mind. Like, when you say double digit, are we talking about somewhere in the teens, or is there a possible scenario where revenues can grow 20%, 30% for IoT in fiscal 2025?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Okay. No, Eddie, thanks for the question. You know, I think we've outlined, generally speaking, we've outlined our sort of Core IoT growth rate at being double that of normal, our normal growth rate. What we're saying as a long-term forecast is sort of 10%-12% on the top line, and we'd expect our Core IoT to be growing at twice that rate. So there's nothing that we've seen that would back us away from those comments and those projections that we outlined, you know, a handful of quarters ago. In fact, our wireless business is doing better than that. Our processor business, as we said in the prepared remarks, kind of too early to tell, but we're seeing good early signs there.

You know, we feel like the wireless business is, you know, a 20%+ grower on aggregate, and again, nothing we've seen that would back us off of those projections.

Speaker 9

That's super helpful. And just a follow-up. I think you mentioned as well partnering with new system integrators, and that would significantly impact your growth rate, quote unquote. Maybe, Michael, can you talk a little bit about that? Like, how big of a driver that can be, and why these partnerships specifically can be significant to your growth rate going forward? Like, are they focused on specific applications or geographies that you guys haven't tapped before? Just any color on that would be helpful. That's it for me. Thank you.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah. Eddie, again, I appreciate the question, a good one. You know, two things, right? You've heard me talk about in the wireless business, these module partners in the past that really help us bring wireless to market much more rapidly. You know, we've had one really key partner in the module area for wireless, and we said in the prepared remarks, we've added a couple more. Those represent significant opportunities because they're helping us reach a much broader set of customers much more quickly. In wireless, you have a situation whereby there's a lot of components, RF components and power amplifiers and other things that go in those modules, and that time to market that the module folks enable is critical.

The comment you're referring to is on the processor side, and it's a very similar thing, where you have a guy that's gonna aggregate a system with a processor, with wireless connectivity, with software, and those system integrators are then able to reach out to a number of different customers and tweak the platform slightly for a given application. So while in wireless, we have a lot of experience and ability to go scale to these module folks, in processors, less so, but I'm very optimistic that the same model prevails. That these processor scaling partners help us reach a much broader set of customers, much more quickly. We can go one to many in a much easier fashion than we can if we have to deal with all these customers by ourselves.

Speaker 9

Great. Thank you, Michael.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Thanks, Eddie.

Operator (participant)

Thanks for your question. One moment, please. Our next question comes from the line of Peter Peng from JPMorgan. The line is yours.

Peter Peng (VP of Equity Research)

Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my question, and congrats on the results, and welcome to the team, Ken. Thank you. Just on, you talked about that inventory digestion. Seems like it's kind of gone and, you know, inventory is, it's quite clean. So does that indicate that you're kind of shipping based on you guys, that you're shipping to end demand, or do you still feel that, you know, we're still kind of shipping below end demand at this point?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

... Yeah, I, Peter, again, good question. I do think we're shipping below end demand. I think, you know, you have a sell out that's clearly larger than the sell-in, because we've cleared out quite a significant amount of inventory. I'd be hesitant to size that, but it's clear that we're under shipping, right? Because the inventory in the channel has been worked down during the course of the year, and you can see the level of our shipments. So I'd say that under shipment phenomenon is there. There still is pretty muted end demand, so the thing that surprised us, and I think we've talked about this for the last handful of quarters, is we'd expected once inventory to clear out, to get to a much higher level of shipment.

We're not there because I think that on top of the inventory problem, there has been a demand issue that's been underlying it. But clearly, we're, you know, our ship in is less than ship out, so we're under shipping. And I think that as this demand profile recovers or the demand environment recovers, we'll see a kind of a second uptick.

Peter Peng (VP of Equity Research)

Got it. Thanks. And then this is a kind of a gross margin trajectory. If I kind of look at your end market, it seems like you're most positive on the continual recovery in Core IoT and Enterprise and Automotive, and Mobile may be kind of, kind of chugging along. So I would think that, you know, there's gonna be some product mix headwind in your gross margin. So can you just talk about how you think about gross margins over the next couple of quarters?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, I think that's right. We've set aside a target of 57%, and 57% is really based on that Enterprise and Automotive shipping at full throat. The Enterprise and Automotive is clearly well above 57%, in a basket from where we stand. Processors and wireless are at or slightly below that 57% number, and then Mobile is quite a bit below. So the aggregate says that when we're shipping it, you know, kind of full tilt on Enterprise and Automotive, we would expect that the whole basket goes up to 57%. As Core IoT continues to do well, in opposition to the Enterprise and Automotive, you're right, there's a little bit of a downdraft on the gross margin.

Operator (participant)

Thank you for your question. Again, as a reminder, to ask a question, please press star one one on your telephone. One moment, please. Our next question comes from the line of Jason Getz from Mizuho Securities. The line is yours.

Jason Getz (VP of Equity Research)

Hey, guys. Thanks for letting me ask a question. You mentioned on the IT budgets reset November and December. In those preliminary conversations you have with customers, just wondering what kind of impressions are you getting on those budgets for next year? Do you think that they could maybe be stretched to include some more enterprise spend, or do we need to see a pullback in that AI spend before enterprise can return?

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, I don't- I mean, to the second part of the question, I don't think so. I mean, I think the two things are- have been very related, that you know, on more limited budgets, the allocation is very much going toward AI spend. We would hope that generally you're gonna be able to feed both sides of the equation as budgets get reset. But to the first part of your question, we really don't have visibility. We know our numbers internally, and we're going through that budgeting cycle now with Ken and Matt, but we can't really tell what other companies are doing in that regard.

Jason Getz (VP of Equity Research)

Got it. Thanks. And then maybe a little bit of a follow-up question on the gross margin side. I get that, you know, mix is a big piece of it, but as we are kind of getting back to that enterprise demand, do you see any levers, you know, that are more in your control that can help get a little bit of improvement as you track towards the 57%? Maybe something like pricing or just some of the more costs can come out, anything that could, you know, create some upside there.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, we're looking at all of that. I mean, I think that that's a fair point. You know, we went through an environment of significant price ups during COVID. We've not seen a lot of revisions on the cost line from our foundry and OSAT partners. But as we sort of look out, and again, Ken coming on board, how we think about our pricing strategy, particularly in areas we have pricing power. I mean, if you remember, I've characterized the business as having a significant number of markets in which we play, where we have sizable market share and the ability to command some level of pricing power.

As we look out across the balance of this fiscal year, I think we're gonna look at that a little more closely, and see where we do have opportunity to potentially raise prices in markets where we have stronger positions. But all that's TBD. What I can tell you is I think on the cost line, marginally better, we're seeing marginally better pricing, but, not enough to really favorably move the needle. Our number one needle mover, as we've talked about, is always mix, and then we may, if we don't see mix improving, we may look at pricing levers to see what we can do.

Jason Getz (VP of Equity Research)

Got it. Thank you very much.

Operator (participant)

Thank you for your question. At this time, I'm showing no further questions. This concludes the question and answer session. I would now like to turn it back to Michael Hurlston, Chief Executive Officer, for closing remarks.

Michael Hurlston (President and CEO)

Yeah, I'd like to thank everybody for their questions and for joining this call, and we look forward to speaking to you at upcoming investor events throughout the quarter. Thank you.

Operator (participant)

Thank you for your participation in today's conference. This does conclude the program. You may now disconnect.